Gay Mormon Man / PriesthoodMen: The future of the Mormon church -- Not what you think.

Saturday, February 21, 2015

The future of the Mormon church -- Not what you think.

Just working a comparison to see if it makes sense without oversimplifying. I tend to simplify. It's the primary teacher in me.

If the Catholic Church says it is not right to speak ill of ones neighbor, and is outspoken about it in the media, are they taking away any one's agency to gossip? I think most would say no. The pontiff may not be happy with your blog on Brenda's bad hair color, but it is your choice just the same.

Do the Catholics still have the right to speak out against speaking ill towards ones neighbors? Do they have the right to say no to that on principal?

How about the gossipers or one who reserves the right to say what he wants about Brenda's hair color. Do they have the right to protest the churches stance on gossiping?

This isn't really working, is it? It's to simplistic. Of course I am trying to make the comparison to the LDS church and their stance against Gay marriage in the church.

Right off the bat one could say that no one is trying to affect laws that would dis-allow gossip. It is considered free speech -- free speech that some would not take part in -- but free speech all the same. In a similar fashion the LDS church is not currently pursuing any same sex marriage legislation after prop 8.

From what I saw, once the courts disallowed the vote based on constitutional right, the church followed article of faith nine and accepted the law of the land.

The LDS church says that they don't believe that gays should be allowed to marry.

They have the right to speak out.
Others have the right to protest their opinion.
Mormons have the right to not allow gays full fellowship in their organization.
Others have the right to choose their religion and there are many that don't even have full fellowship in their vernacular.

LGBT people can be Mormon and be in full fellowship by following the standards of the church. Lately, it seems, LGBT people who do not adhere to the standards of the church can more and more retain their membership depending often on the covenants they have made in the temple -- covenants to remain morally clean.

It seems to me that there are few possible scenarios for the future.

1) The LDS church changes its doctrine and allows gays to marry in the temple. This would involve instruction from the Head of the Church. The real Head of the Church. Mormons believe in revelation from the Lord. For a doctrinal change the line of authority would be followed. This would be monumental.

2) New knowledge would be received and taught to the church leaders and then directly to the general membership that would make plain current doctrine . Mormons believe that God will yet reveal many great and important things pertaining to the Kingdom of God. Is there more information available concerning gay marriage?

3) The LDS church is forced by US law to allow gay marriages. This seems to be the doomsday church leaders reasonable foresee - the reason I believe that there is a push for religious rights to be acknowledged and maintained. But before this scenario could happen, members would be required to marry civilly and later get sealed in the temple. Hanging by a thread, anyone?

Article of Faith 11: We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may.

5 comments:

UnknownFebruary 21, 2015 at 12:09 PM
The Catholic Church does not allow divorce and will not marry people who have divorced. The government allows divorce and allows divorced people to be married again, but it has never forced the Catholic Church to sanction divorce or perform marriages for those who have divorced. Why would it be any different for same-sex marriages? The government is not going to force any religion to perform marriages that they do not want to, and the precedent for that has already been set with Catholics and divorce.

Question for you - are same-sex couples who are married to each other and who are monogamous, are they morally unclean? Are they really any different from straight married couples who are monogamous?

If the issue is moral cleanliness, is it not better to allow all people (gay or straight) to express physical love in marriage? Is it realistic to ask anyone to remain celibate and alone their entire lives with no hope or chance of loving someone in every sense of the word? Even straight members who are single have the hope that they might meet someone to marry. Women who were single for a long time have even ended up marrying apostles! One could even marry a non-member and still remain an LDS Church member in good standing.

The Church does not completely ban straight members from expressing physical love, it just asks that they wait until marriage. It even allows divorce and multiple marriages. Until the same kind of thing is fairly offered to gay LDS members (whether in the temple or not) the vast majority of LGBTQ members will separate from the Church (and rightly so).
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cal thompsonFebruary 21, 2015 at 2:10 PM
Thank you for your response. Forgive me if I jump from point to point.
Laws are created by legislators who represent the people. The people, to my knowledge have not rallied against the Catholic Church for their stance on Divorce.

If the LDS church establishes marriage as between a man and a woman, then yes, a same sex couple are not obeying the law of chastity. I understand the dilemma and the argument. I am a gay man and a member of the church. According to the LDS church it is different for a hetro couple.

The issue, as I understand it, is not moral cleanliness as per man but as per the Law of Chastity which Mormons believe is a law that God established for his people. It would solve many problems today to allow all people to express physical love in marriage, but if we believe the law came from a higher power then we would look to him for more information/explanation/clarification/change.
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AnonymousFebruary 22, 2015 at 11:38 PM
Item number 3 is based on an unfortunately popular bit of misinformation. Churches will not be forced to solemnize gay marriages. There is simply no mechanism under federal law for doing that. See, e.g., http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/jurisprudence/2012/12/gay_marriage_churches_synagogues_and_mosques_won_t_be_forced_to_conduct.html
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I order to better understand one another, I think it would be wise to understand the terms used in these essays. What I propose is an Examination for Discovery, which is briefly a meeting of the opposing sides in a lawsuit where the plaintiff and defendant, with their attorneys, meet to examine each others claims and see whether they can find some area of agreement and thus save the time of the court later on. This is assuming that there is common ground, and I believe that even the most cynical of us would agree that there is.

It will be hard to understand one another if you think blue is periwinkle and I think blue is turquoise. I know that the differences may not be a big deal - between periwinkle and turquoise - but I think its best to be incredibly clear. We both may disagree on what blue is, but, for purposes of communication, we will use the terms as listed here - adding when needed.

Of coarse they may be subject to change and/or refinement with experience and further knowledge – and with feedback. Being that this is a blog and not a diatribe, I get to lead I suppose.

List of Common Terms On Which We May Agree
or Agree To Agree On For Sake of Discussion*

For sensitivity reasons we wanted to run this list past my Gramma Ruby, which would have been really helpful not to mention miraculous because she died at an Elizabeth Dole Rally in Boise)

Active: 1) A lifestyle characterized by frequent or various social, intellectual, and particularly physical activities; 2) In geology, a volcano which erupts regularly; 3) A member of the LDS Church who is often seen carrying brownies, scriptures or children back and forth to Church.

Affirmation: 1) A positive assertion. 2) An organization for LDS homosexuals and the people that love them, but not affiliated or supported by the LDS Church.

Sentence: Falling off of the stage was the affirmation she needed to confirm the universality of gravity.

Acronyms: SGA, SGB, SGI SGA: Same Gender (sexual) Attraction SGB: Same Gender (sexual) Behavior SGI: Same Gender (gay) Identity

OGA, OGB, OGI OGA: Opposite Gender (sexual) attraction OGB: Opposite Gender (sexual) behavior OGI: Opposite Gender (heterosexual) identity.

Sentence: The LDS SGA think OGA from ID, WO and MT dress like the NFL.

Beehive: 1) Home to bees, 2) A height-positive sixties hair style which many Mormon women continued to wear through the seventies and into late nineties and early 00’s with a slight revamp; 3) Young woman’s organization of girls who can’t drive yet.

Bisexual: 1) A sexual behavior or an orientation involving physical, mental or romantic attraction to both males and females.

Choice: 1) A decision between two or more option, and often referred to as free agency, personal rights and freedom.

Sentence: The choice for Juan Carlo was to either be eaten alive by the anaconda or jump from the boat into the mouth of the hungry crocodile.

Church: 1) An identifiable religious body under a common name; 2) a physical structure often equipped with a satellite dish, food warming area and an indoor basketball court.

Sentence: The ambulance and two squad cars were sent to the ball game at the Church between the elders and the priests due to last year’s “incident.”

Closet: 1) Upright storage space for clothing; 2) Slang reference to the status of an individual wishing to remain private about his/her sex life and who hasn’t acknowledged their SGA feelings yet to friends and family members.

Sentence: He had been in the closet so long he smelled like cedar and old shoes.

Coming Out: 1) The act of leaving a building or structure. 2) The process of telling people about one’s homosexuality is often referred to as coming out.

Sentence: “It’s just not coming out”, muttered Sister Macbeth as she compulsively applied spot remover.

Conversion therapy, or reparative therapy or reorientation therapy: 1) A type of sexual orientation change effort that attempts to change the sexual orientation of a person from homosexual or bisexual to heterosexual. In the past techniques have included psychoanalytic group therapy involving aversive conditioning, electric shock or nausea-inducing drugs, and may have included sex therapy. Today there seems to be a more subtle and genteel approach which is being met with more success,

Down Low or DL : 1)This term means different things to different people, however generally it connotes dishonesty and hiding. 2) A term for men who discreetly have sex with other men while in marital relationships with women. Often these men do not consider themselves homosexual or bisexual, and their female partners are generally not aware of these infidelities.

Ex-Gay: Term for those who have experienced SGAttraction and who, for religious or other reasons, have chosen not to embrace a gay identity, or to engage in SGA behavior.

Family Group Sheets: 1) Forms used in annotating genealogy; 2) Money saving tactics for Mormon families at bedtime.

Sentence: Laverne and Lavelle grab your sister and a family group sheet and get you off to bed.

Families are Forever: 1) LDS catch phrase originating in the early eighties - referring to the belief that temple sealed families created on earth can move into the next life together. 2) The prevalent attitude after two weeks of dealing with the new in-laws.

Sentence: Did you hear our new sister-in-law-sing the Duran-Duran Medley? Are families really forever?

Folk Doctrine: 1) Doctrines that develop from prevailing rumor.

Sentence: Three stakes in Pocatello have been asked to spear-head a pilot program for the Churches new Work and Glory aerobics program.

Gay: 1) A happy and joyful method of celebrating holidays often sung about in English Carols and Fred Astaire films. 2) A common term for an individual attracted to their same gender. Gay has been a widely used synonym of "male homosexual." Its meaning is rapidly evolving to refer to both male and female homosexuals. Some people differentiate between homosexual and gay: homosexual is regarded as a sexual orientation; gay is a political identity -- i.e. an advocate for equal rights for persons of all sexual orientations

Sentence: Sister Fellows always regretted naming her eldest son after her favorite uncle, Gaylord.

Gender: 1) The set of characteristics that distinguish between female and male members of a species. It is often used interchangeably with the word "sex" denoting the condition of being male or female.

Sentence: “But, Julie,” Cal whined, “I simply don’t have an inoffensive sentence for the word gender.”

Genealogy: 1) An activity Mormons do happily while praying to hook up with a distant relative who has done all the work.

Sentence: Brother The-Hun was a bit disturbed when his grandma showed him his genealogy line went directly to some guy named Attila.

Heterosexual: 1) People whose emotional, sexual and romantic feelings are primarily for those of the opposite sex or having to do with opposite sex attraction.

Homophobia: 1) An irrational fear, prejudice or discrimination towards homosexuals. Homophobia can take many forms, from name-calling and teasing to serious crimes like assault and murder. Homophobia like other irrational fears is most often based on ignorance.

Homosexual: 1) People whose emotional, sexual and romantic feelings are primarily for those of the same sex or having to do with same sex attraction.

In: See out.

Last days: 1) A horrific time of floods, famines, political strife and food storage eating – much like yesterday.

Sentence: The last days of a back to school sale appear to be frequented by women on a weekend pass from the state hospital.

Lesbian: Term to describe sexual and romantic desire between females.

Lifestyle: The term lifestyle (as in gay lifestyle) has become a polarizing term though used by gay and lesbian people in the past. “Those in the lifestyle” usually means “those who identify as gay", though it may refer to behavior as well as identity - much as LDS lifestyle would mean those living the teachings or of the culture, or East Coast Lifestyle may refer to black turtle necks, bookstores and apartment living.

Many are called, but few are chosen: 1) What I keep telling myself when I am asked to be on the ward activities committee again.

Mixed Marriage: For our purposes here, a union between one of “heterosexual” orientation with one dealing with SGA.

Out: See in.

Prophet: 1) A man called of God who holds the keys to direct the Church and to speak for Jesus Christ. The President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is a chosen prophet, seer and revelator.

SSA: 1) Acronym for Same Sex Attraction. The LDS Church prefers SGA, (which I always thought stood for Star Gate Atlantis reruns) but actually means Same Gender Attraction. SSA and SGA are terms not highly favored among the gay community. Neither, for that matter, is the phrase “gay community”.

Sentence: ST-TNG and SGA are playing all week on SI-FI.

Sin: To behave in a manner that is contrary to the revealed commandments of God.

Transgendered: A designation of person whose identity does not conform to conventional notions of male or female gender roles.

Quotes, Quotation Marks: Tool used to set apart a word or phrase. For our purposes here, generally speaking, using quotation marks to denote words such as “gay” or “homosexual” is offensive. If you are not comfortable with using a term from the “so-called other side”, then it is recommended that a substitute which doesn't involve quote marks is found.

Sentence: I am offended that “he” just used quotations on the phrase other side.

Straight: 1) A direction which veers neither to the left or the right. 2) A slang term used in the place of heterosexual.

Sentence: The geography club, Straights of Magellan is not accepting new members.

Strait is the gate and narrow is the way: 1) Popular scripture quote used to encourage righteous living and weight loss.

Tithing: 1) One tenth of one’s income donated voluntarily to the LDS Church for upkeep and needed things.

Sentence: Ten percent of nothing is still nothing.

Urim and Thummim: 1) Tool used by Joseph Smith to translate the Book of Mormon. 2) What I wish I had to understand my kids text messages.

Wickedness Never Was Happiness: 1) What Cal’s first missionary companion in the MTC from Macon Georga wrote on his left bicep with a sharpie when visas to Central America didn’t come through on time. 2) Comment made by those on their way to Church when a boat or motor-home pulls up in the next lane of traffic.

This is a blog for Mormon SSA* men who wish to follow the teachings of the LDS church while owning their Homosexuality. It can be done! This blog-spot is written by a sort-of smart gay man who is a card-carrying member of the LDS church and hopes to remain so. He will remain so by following the teachings of the prophets. His motto for today is "Many a true word spoken in jest," and he will try to not be so charming.

Mr. Thompson thinks he knows just about everything. Lately, it has been proposed that he may, in actuality, not. He is trying to be open to that thought.